|
|
Post by kool on Dec 28, 2006 22:32:20 GMT -5
KenHolzman the smartass says:
LOL. That's BS.
So, has there been a Springsteen poll here yet? I wanna get my blood back for Holzman's Neil-bashing. ;D
|
|
|
|
Post by Kensterberg on Dec 28, 2006 22:37:47 GMT -5
I never indulge in gratuitous Neil bashing -- except maybe on Mary's bashing board!
I was just speaking the truth -- Neil has worked very hard to keep his entire output mediocre by always including at least one absolute dud per record. He also does his best to avoid actually putting any two styles together on one album -- with the result that they all sound monochromatic, even though he's covered a pretty fair chunk of stylistic ground. All the genre hopping he did in the eighties could've yielded one or two absolutely brilliant records (maybe), but instead he put out waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too much material, and a bunch of it stank to high heaven.
Ragged Glory was actually one of the best things he's ever done, and by your own standards you can't listen to it all the way through on a regular basis! So I'm just speaking the truth here as I see it. ;D
|
|
|
|
Post by kool on Dec 28, 2006 22:49:19 GMT -5
Yes, but the reason many of Neil's albums have been patchy over the years is because he's prolific. He puts out a new studio album almost every other year. Even to this day!
Unlike that lazy dude from Jersey who's run out of ideas and is stooping to doing covers albums to pay the bills ;D
|
|
|
|
Post by Galactus on Dec 28, 2006 23:27:26 GMT -5
Holzman knows nothing of Neil Young.
|
|
|
|
Post by upinkzeppelin2 on Dec 28, 2006 23:56:02 GMT -5
Neil has worked very hard to keep his entire output mediocre by always including at least one absolute dud per record.
Excuse me, Ken, but Harvest Moon doesn't have a single dud on it.
|
|
|
|
Post by wayved on Dec 29, 2006 1:08:15 GMT -5
Ken-haha! I wish that was the reason I voted for on the Beach!
Neil Young is NOT monochromatic. He's weird. Shit, what would you do if making music was what you had to do for a living? Sure, all of his albums don't succeed musically AND commercially (or either) but thats what I like about Neil Young. I want to hear "T-Bone" and the ENTIRE second side of HAWKS AND DOVES. And ARC? What the hell was Neil thinking (or not thinking)? Maybe you are right--he has not put out a definitive "statement" album--thats good. Maybe thats what has kept his career (and puzzlingly enough, his fan base--the ones who actually listen to more than "Southern Man") alive. Could be wrong....
Alright then. I didnt vote correctly the first time. On the Beach gets my vote. I like that whole string of records-Time Fades Away, Tonights the Night, On the Beach. (those were not in order)
My top 5 neil Young Albums: (like it really matters!)
1. Harvest (bought it for a dime at a used record store I was working in as a 15 year old--first Neil Young album i heard)--my dad actually said "you like Neil Young?"
2. On The Beach--fucking sad. If I didnt hear his stuff with Buffalo Springfield (example Expecting to Fly) I wouldnt know what he is on about. This resonated with the depressed bastard that I am the first time I heard it. And the sad part is I love it more every time I listen to it.
3. Tonights the Night--Same thing--"Mellow My Mind" is one of the best Neil Young songs ever.
Some knock it down for its drama or what have you. Whatever.
4. Comes A Time--Yeah yeah yeah--all mellow. Perfect! even "Motorcycle Mama" provides comic relief!
5. Zuma--get this, play it. I also suggest drinking an alcoholic beverage of your choice. Plan on cleaning house. Your place is gonna look good once side two is through.
By the way--I read that Reprise put out a LIVING WITH WAR-RAW version out. Wasent the original raw enough? Is this true?
Best song that Neil Young threw out there while on Geffen--"Weight of the World"--though marred by its stuck in time production its a pretty good song.
Meleun--I have never listened really closely to Harvest Moon. I will have to do that soon!
|
|
|
|
Post by Galactus on Dec 29, 2006 1:58:51 GMT -5
Yeah, the Living With War - The Beginning, is rough mixes before all the backing vocals and overdubs.
The honest truth is the Giffen albums aren't bad, the production is terrible but the songs are good. Try to track down some live versions.
|
|
|
|
Post by frag on Dec 29, 2006 8:56:10 GMT -5
My vote goes to Harvest. He was all around at his best there...lyrically, musically...and his vocals were top notch. All my opinion, of course. But Harvest is his best.
The man's got some killer songs all over the place, but I sort of agree with Ken there, that they're surrounded by some duds. Harvest on the other hand...dud free.
|
|
|
|
Post by Kensterberg on Dec 29, 2006 9:54:37 GMT -5
I love that Nelson is a serious contender for the title of "Greatest Neil Young Album." Priceless.
|
|
|
|
Post by Galactus on Dec 29, 2006 10:10:00 GMT -5
Yeah priceless. Listen Holzman, how 'bout you name another artist for whom such widespread opinions about his best work are through out said artist's entire career?
|
|
|
|
Post by Kensterberg on Dec 29, 2006 10:29:46 GMT -5
As I see it, the fact that no two fans can agree on Neil's best work indicates just how spotty it is. Even with artists who've indisputably made multiple great records, the conversation among fans comes down to a handful of contenders for "the greatest." The classic example of this would be the Beatles -- fans wind up discussing the merits of Revolver, Sgt. Pepper, Abbey Road, The Beatles (white album), and Rubber Soul. Most of the discussion about Sgt. Pepper these days is why it doesn't belong in that select group. Bring up the Stones, and its all about Beggar's Banquet, Let It Bleed, and Exile on Main Street (with some nut bringing in Some Girls or Sticky Fingers just 'cause they like it). [Please note: I'm one of those nuts. I'll take Some Girls song for song over anything else in the Stones' catalog.] There is an agreement about what these artists represent, and which albums mark the high spots of their careers.
With Neil Young, there's never been any agreement, partially b/c Neil has never decided himself. And again, I've got no problem with artists genre hopping (I love Sandinista! and I'm a huge Bowie fan, fer chrissakes), but Neil has never really moved past the dilletente (sp?) stage in anything. His guitar rock has gotten louder, but is fundementally unchanged from where it was when he wrote Cinamon Girl, for example. His folkie numbers today aren't significantly different from what he was doing more than thirty years ago. He's substituted genre hopping for real artistic growth. He doesn't have Dylan's gift for stringing words together (and frankly, Dylan doesn't always have this gift!) in a mesmorizing fashion, nor does he have Springsteen's skill with story-telling.
A final note on Harvest Moon, and all Neil's latter day folkie music ... I just can't deal with his high, keening tenor. This is purely a personal thing, but just like some people can't listen to Dylan b/c of his voice, I just can't take Neil's falsetto. Also, his use of harmonies on some of his older rockers (particularly the ones that featured CSN on backups) is like fingernails on a chalkboard to my ears. I just don't like these things.
|
|
|
|
Post by Kensterberg on Dec 29, 2006 10:40:55 GMT -5
Also, in the interest of absolute full disclosure, I was, um, involved with a girl once who was a huge Neil Young fan. I really liked Live Rust and Weld at that time, and can't hear "Like a Hurricane" without thinking about her. But as we began to wear on each other, Neil began to irratate me more and more. Little things about the songs that I had been overlooking began to bother me, I noticed that there really wasn't any depth to his lyrics, it was all surface ... you get the idea.
And so anyway, about the time that she drove off to Austin, Neil Young was also out of rotation with me.
While I don't think this has overly impacted my take on Neil's catalog (I was ambivelent about him before, and I'm ambivelent about him now, but for about eight months I listened to him a whole hell of a lot), it may have. And it certainly does account for the fact that I never, ever, listen to "Like a Hurricane" any more.
BTW, "The Needle and the Damage Done" is IMHO one of the greatest songs about drugs in rock, and is still in regular rotation in my music collection. There are a couple others ("Hey Hey, My My" for example) as well.
|
|
|
|
Post by Galactus on Dec 29, 2006 11:31:27 GMT -5
I'd be okay if I never heard the Needle again and while Harvest is one of those albums a large percentage would call his best, I don't really listen to it very much. Like with Exile though if you can't hear how Tonight's The Night or On The Beach capture the feelings of loss and exhaustion and hope and hopelessness then there isn't anything I can say to change your mind. Also Neil's genre hopping has been greatly exaggerated, his furtherest reach (which I won't claim was entirely successful or unsuccessful) was Trans but rock, country and folk should hardly be considered genre hopping. He ain't Elvis Costello.
I'm not sure how the logic that since there's less agreement about which three or four albums are his best makes them spotty. I'd say it shows how consistent his career has actually been, that albums twenty years apart could truly be counted among his best work.
My daughter wants to type-
cat dog bat
|
|
|
|
Post by Kensterberg on Dec 29, 2006 11:37:50 GMT -5
Needle is the only song on Harvest that I really like. Love your daughters comments!  |
|
|
|
Post by rockysigman on Dec 29, 2006 12:09:07 GMT -5
I like some of the songs on Harvest, but all the songs with the orchestra are absolutely unbearable.
|
|
