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Post by luke on Mar 1, 2006 15:17:09 GMT -5
Memphis vs. Nashville = Austin vs. Dallas.
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Post by Fuzznuts on Mar 1, 2006 16:50:26 GMT -5
I remember when I saw Neko Case in Champaign, IL she had just finished playing in Nashville. She remarked how she has never been to a city that hated music more than Nashville. So there's that.
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Post by someone on Mar 3, 2006 4:16:50 GMT -5
As disenchanted with Vegas as I have become over the seven years I've lived here, I feel I need to defend it somewhat, what with it being home now and all, but mostly because if you're coming here looking for culture as in museums and art and theater and symphony, then you're really missing the point.
The casinos, the 24 hour lifestyle, the never ending drinks, that IS the culture. That's what separates Vegas from every other city in this country, that's what's unique about it. You call it fake? We know we're motherfucking fake. We accept it, we embrace it, we charge you 7$ a glass to drink it so we don't have to pay state income tax. We're more real than any of you. We want your money. We demand your money. We're not shy about it. We don't sugar coat it and wrap it up in breasts we swear are real and tell you we eat five small meals a day to maintain our healthy lifestyle. We're not LA. We're anorexic, we're starving, our breasts are fucking fake and it's all typed out on the brochure. We hand out bleach highlights for males in our airport.
That ad that's been televised nationally-What happens in Vegas blah blah...that's the only thing that's been homogenized, because if you think this isn't the city of sin, you're fucking fooling yourself. This is a red state with legalized prostitution. We sold our souls to the mafia and we vote for people from Texas. That's as sinful as it gets. All seven deadly sins were born in this town, the Old Testament was written about this town, we are Sodom and Gomorrah. You want gluttony? Try visiting a local casino buffet. Greed? Watch a geriatric on oxygen gambling away her social security check while her grandkids drink from half empty beer bottles with scabs ontheir knees. Anger? Have you fucking driven on I-15 during rush hour?
This town is built for escape. It's a mirage in the desert, the promised land for drinkers and smokers and gamblers and whores. Mexicans just over the border making 90,000$ a year as dealers...Vegas is the American dream.
Vegas is every town in America. Hopeless gamblers, on an extended losing streak, rolling the dice, the house burning down around us.
To hate Vegas is to hate America. Hippy.
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Post by luke on Mar 6, 2006 11:21:30 GMT -5
Sweet post.
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Post by Kensterberg on Mar 6, 2006 11:24:39 GMT -5
Fabulous post someone! Great defense of Vegas "as it is" rather than what people would like it to be, or think it was, or whatever.
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Post by Paul on Mar 6, 2006 11:27:08 GMT -5
As disenchanted with Vegas as I have become over the seven years I've lived here, I feel I need to defend it somewhat, what with it being home now and all, but mostly because if you're coming here looking for culture as in museums and art and theater and symphony, then you're really missing the point. The casinos, the 24 hour lifestyle, the never ending drinks, that IS the culture. That's what separates Vegas from every other city in this country, that's what's unique about it. You call it fake? We know we're motherfucking fake. We accept it, we embrace it, we charge you 7$ a glass to drink it so we don't have to pay state income tax. We're more real than any of you. We want your money. We demand your money. We're not shy about it. We don't sugar coat it and wrap it up in breasts we swear are real and tell you we eat five small meals a day to maintain our healthy lifestyle. We're not LA. We're anorexic, we're starving, our breasts are fucking fake and it's all typed out on the brochure. We hand out bleach highlights for males in our airport. That ad that's been televised nationally-What happens in Vegas blah blah...that's the only thing that's been homogenized, because if you think this isn't the city of sin, you're fucking fooling yourself. This is a red state with legalized prostitution. We sold our souls to the mafia and we vote for people from Texas. That's as sinful as it gets. All seven deadly sins were born in this town, the Old Testament was written about this town, we are Sodom and Gomorrah. You want gluttony? Try visiting a local casino buffet. Greed? Watch a geriatric on oxygen gambling away her social security check while her grandkids drink from half empty beer bottles with scabs ontheir knees. Anger? Have you fucking driven on I-15 during rush hour? This town is built for escape. It's a mirage in the desert, the promised land for drinkers and smokers and gamblers and whores. Mexicans just over the border making 90,000$ a year as dealers...Vegas is the American dream. Vegas is every town in America. Hopeless gamblers, on an extended losing streak, rolling the dice, the house burning down around us. To hate Vegas is to hate America. Hippy.  Great fucking write up about your [now] home town. |
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Post by phil on Mar 6, 2006 12:01:29 GMT -5
You know what they say ... "There's no place like HOME" !!
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Post by Mary on Mar 6, 2006 13:32:45 GMT -5
That was indeed a great, great post in defense of yer city, someone! Almost made me want to go back.... almost!!! BTW, Vegas' efforts to create a real downtown, distinct from the Strip and providing the standard "urban" amenities of a "normal" city, is getting a ton of attention in city planning/urban theory circles. Probably the single most ambitious urban revitaization project in the entire country, along the lines of new urbanism. It's going to be really interesting to watch how it takes - does Vegas want a real downtown, and can you create one completely out of scratch, absent any history or rootedness? They're building a huge new performing arts center, a medical campus with a new alzheimers research center built by frank gehry, an arts district and an entertainment district, and beautifying the part of las vegas blvd connecting the strip to downtown so it's pedestrian-friendly, full of shops and restaurants and cafes and bars and such. Lots of new office builings, high-rise residential units, a new city hall, a new stadium, etc etc. And lots of public transportation plans in the works as well to connect downtown to the strip and elsewhere. It all sounds like a new urbanist's wet dream - I'm just really curious to see how it actually transforms the feel of the city... if it can...if people want it.... In any case this web page follows the "changing" Vegas in great detail - it's really interesting stuff: www.vegastodayandtomorrow.com/Cheers, M |
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Post by sisyphus on Mar 7, 2006 4:31:42 GMT -5
As disenchanted with Vegas as I have become over the seven years I've lived here, I feel I need to defend it somewhat, what with it being home now and all, but mostly because if you're coming here looking for culture as in museums and art and theater and symphony, then you're really missing the point. The casinos, the 24 hour lifestyle, the never ending drinks, that IS the culture. That's what separates Vegas from every other city in this country, that's what's unique about it. You call it fake? We know we're motherfucking fake. We accept it, we embrace it, we charge you 7$ a glass to drink it so we don't have to pay state income tax. We're more real than any of you. We want your money. We demand your money. We're not shy about it. We don't sugar coat it and wrap it up in breasts we swear are real and tell you we eat five small meals a day to maintain our healthy lifestyle. We're not LA. We're anorexic, we're starving, our breasts are fucking fake and it's all typed out on the brochure. We hand out bleach highlights for males in our airport. That ad that's been televised nationally-What happens in Vegas blah blah...that's the only thing that's been homogenized, because if you think this isn't the city of sin, you're fucking fooling yourself. This is a red state with legalized prostitution. We sold our souls to the mafia and we vote for people from Texas. That's as sinful as it gets. All seven deadly sins were born in this town, the Old Testament was written about this town, we are Sodom and Gomorrah. You want gluttony? Try visiting a local casino buffet. Greed? Watch a geriatric on oxygen gambling away her social security check while her grandkids drink from half empty beer bottles with scabs ontheir knees. Anger? Have you fucking driven on I-15 during rush hour? This town is built for escape. It's a mirage in the desert, the promised land for drinkers and smokers and gamblers and whores. Mexicans just over the border making 90,000$ a year as dealers...Vegas is the American dream. Vegas is every town in America. Hopeless gamblers, on an extended losing streak, rolling the dice, the house burning down around us. To hate Vegas is to hate America. Hippy. brilliant. have you read 'air guitar' by Dave Hickey? i can see already that you'd like it..... if you have not already read it, that is... |
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zorndeslammes
Streetcorner Musician
RICKSON BY ARMBAR!!1!!!!1!
Posts: 74
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Post by zorndeslammes on Mar 8, 2006 20:28:29 GMT -5
Before I get to my own list, some notes on previously mentioned places:
-Grand Rapids: My girlfriend's brother went to Calvin. No lie. I dunno, its pretty inoffensive compared to, say LA or something.
-Las Vegas: I used to be a big fan of the strip. Huge fan. Then I went there this past week. The "super high class" shit that's going on ruined the place. Utterly and completely. There were still tinges of the old Vegas there, but now? Totally gone. The cheap buffets and breakfasts replaced by $25 shitty buffets that are somehow special because you get reheated pastries now instead. Nah, I ain't feeling it. I thought it would ruin my view of Vegas....then I went to Downtown. It looks like I'm not alone, because the area around Fremont Street is jumping and the energy and feeling I had back 6 years ago is still there. The people who've come to play are there; the strip is now nothing more than a 2 mile long New Jersey nightclub with reverse ATM machines disgused as video poker and slots.
Places I hate? Hmmmm....
-Los Angeles; People here have complained about sprawl and lack of culture or history. Folks, LA is the depth of this. The sprawl is outrageous and flows all the way to Ontario. The traffic is terrible. Water has to be rationed. Poverty here is crushing. Its sweltering and polluted. History? Pff! Who needs that! We've got crackhouses on Hollywood Blvd and homeless men pissing on the Stars. A bunch of the city burned down because people lost their shit here. Do I need to go further?
-The state of Florida: I like to visit Disneyworld and Universal (and, really, Busch Gardens too. and I'd like to go to the Florida State Fair. but I digress), and if that's an issue with me, just die. But the state as a whole is pretty awful. North of Orlando, and its as redneck as the worst of South Carolina. Miami is a shithole ghetto surrounded by sprawling, worthless suburbia. Everything is a goddamned tourist site and has satellite attractions as well. Tampa almost saves the state, having the Dali Museum and a nice bridge, but fuck this. Even Key West is like a shitty Provincetown/Palm Springs.
-St. Louis: Come for the food, then immediately leave. This place has been treated like crap. The river is shit colored. The ghettos are massive and ugly, with virtually no clear attempt by the city to revitalize anything. Go a few blocks down the road from the RCA Dome and you're surrounded by panhandlers and people wondering what the hell you're doing in that neck of the woods. Hell, go anywhere and you're barraged by the homeless. Not only is it flatout dirty, its in Missouri. Think of Missouri like PA, with St. Louis being Philly and Kansas City being Pittsburgh. Now imagine the whole place sucking ass. Really bad.
-Denver: I don't really hate it that much, really. But it has the worst amusement park I ever went to, lobbed square in an ugly downtown, with terrible traffic, inhuman smog, and shitty, endless suburban sprawl. Oh, and it snows like 20 ft. Just say no.
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Post by Mary on Mar 8, 2006 22:43:02 GMT -5
-Los Angeles; People here have complained about sprawl and lack of culture or history. Folks, LA is the depth of this. The sprawl is outrageous and flows all the way to Ontario. The traffic is terrible. Water has to be rationed. Poverty here is crushing. Its sweltering and polluted. History? Pff! Who needs that! We've got crackhouses on Hollywood Blvd and homeless men pissing on the Stars. A bunch of the city burned down because people lost their shit here. Do I need to go further? Ahhh, L.A. As an SF resident who grew up in Boston, I am morally obligated to hate LA for all the reasons you list. But, the thing is, I don't. It's not that I think you're wrong about anything - L.A. sprawl is absolutely hideous and it's truly a monster that's consuming and destroying everything in its wake - but within that sprawl, I truly believe that LA is a fascinating place... First of all, as far as culture, it's simply false to say that LA has no culture. The Getty is one of the best art museums in the country (and an architectural phenomenon in and of itself), and there's also an excellent Museum of Contemporary Art. Beyond this, though, LA has a thriving gallery scene, probably second only to NY... or perhaps third behind NY and SF. It's one of the best places in America to see Mexican art and experience Mexican culture. And in the Watts Towers, LA has got one of the single greatest and most awe-inspiring pieces of fantasy/outsider art & architecture in the entire world. LA is actually an architectural wet dream, despite also being a mess of every different style thrown together almost completely incoherently - but if you can deal with the bizarre disorienation of such architectural chaos, it's absolutely fascinating! Now then, there's Hollywood. Obviously Hollywood is awful for all the reasons we already know - but living in the film capital of the universe has its cultural benefits. The city gets fantastic festivals - indie, foreign, international, classic, director-focused, actor-focused, etc etc. And it's got every possible kind of theater - revival theaters, second run theaters, indie theaters, weird experimental arthouse theaters, big megacinemas for the blockbusters, and the New Beverly which does classic film double features all the time. It ain't Paris (or New York, actually) - Paris is the best place on earth for a film history geek - but it's still pretty wonderful!!! As for the feel of the city - as an enormous multicultural city, one of the world's megalopolises, it would be impossible for L.A. not to have fascinating neighobrhoods and districts - and it does. I love Silverlake, a wonderfully diverse and creative neighborhood. Every possible kind of cuisine is available in LA, of course. Get off of the ultra-trendy ultra-famous nightclubs on Sunset and there's a fabulous, weird, quirky bar scene, with every kind of dark should-be-smoky (damn california anti-smoking laws!) bar catering to every imaginable kind of subculture. Finally, there's something to be said for LA's status as a mythical place. The city has a sensibilty - Mike Davis named one chapter of his famous book on LA, City of Quartz, "Sunshine or Noir?" because that dichotomy perfectly captures LA's dichotomy - the sunshiney surface, and the darkness, sleaze, and moral corruption lurking just beneath. This dichotomy gives LA much of its cultural resonance and mythology - from the beaches to Raymond Chandler, from palm trees to Double Indemnity and Blade Runner and, of course, Chinatown, from Poison and Motley Crue to X an Black Flag - L.A. is a city that, for me, feels like it's full of shadows and secrets and conspiracies. A city of dreams and of broken dreams and of nightmares, the perfect location for a David Lynch movie (see Mulholland Drive!) - all the has-beens and never-weres and also-rans and might-have-beens, populating the seedy residential motels and crumbling apartments, working as waitresses and waiters and massage therapists and bellboys and bartenders.... there's something very dark and nightmarish about this, the flipside of the American dream right in the middle of the land of beaches and eternal sunshine - and that feeling is really compelling to me, endlessly fascinating. LA might not have much of a history of its own, but it does have a mythology, and in that, it's ahead of most cities. I wouldn't wanna live in LA - give me SF or NYC. But it's an amazing and singular place, endlessly fascinating from a million different perspectives - I love visiting the City of Angels, and I think its bad reputation is overstated and undeserved. Cheers, M |
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Post by limitdeditionlayla on Mar 8, 2006 22:53:39 GMT -5
We're planning a trip to the States that will hopefully occur in northern summer 2007. When I plan trips I hoard travel books (have dozens so far...instead of buying Guides to Europe like normal people I buy the indivdual book on each country, even if its Croatia or Bulgaria, which have 6 attractions each) - anyway, that post on LA has me more enthused than this entire book  Its because there was no mention of the Crue. Damn you Lonely Planet, uncultured hoons. |
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Post by rockysigman on Mar 8, 2006 22:59:12 GMT -5
What other cities are you planning to visit? How long of a trip are you planning for?
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Post by limitdeditionlayla on Mar 8, 2006 23:11:39 GMT -5
Ideally, we want to start in NYC, then crisscross around to the west coast. LA to Sydney is a 12 hour fight, so the trip would end there.
I'd like to spend a good 8 weeks in the US, I think any less in a country that size you'd miss out on too much.
As for cities...we're still working that one out, but it will consist of major tourist attraction cities & nostalgic must-see's (eg Seattle). I'm just not sure on the logistics of it...whether we should fly from city to city, bus or drive. Am hesitant to drive in such a big, busy country where you all travel on the wrong side.
I like this thread. Foreigner preconceptions of American cities are so off the mark sometimes.
Someone talk about Detroit please. I love KISS & the Pistons, I have to visit that city.
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Post by limitdeditionlayla on Mar 8, 2006 23:17:40 GMT -5
There are few greater pleasures in life than going somwhere & singing the namesake song of that city. Singing Detroit Rock City in Detroit?
*dies of awesomeness*
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Great fucking write up about your [now] home town.
