Beatles vs Rolling Stones

[JACkory]

Here here..patiently awaiting enlightenment. Nothing King Crimson has ever done is "simple"...

[stratman19]

I like the Beatles and the Stones, but had to cast my vote for the Stones. I just like 'em better.

[maarts]

The music of Sigur Ros consistantly moves me to rapturous heights on the strength of melody and music alone...that's all they really have to work with in regards to me, seeing as how I don't understand the language.
Same can be said about the Cocteau Twins, who don't even use "real" language.
What, do I need to insist that they start writing English lyrics that connect with what I happen to be going through at this stage in my journey or else I'm "not demanding enough"?

Spot on. That's the main reason my all time favourite band is Dead Can Dance who, like Sigur Ros and Cocteau Twins didn't want to restrain the listener by shackling their experience of the music with lyrics that would earth the experience. Music in a lot of ways is escapism, whether it's a transcendental thing or physical, by way of dance and movement. It's all about demanding from yourself not to stick to certain 'ground values' as in regards to lyrics, traditional song formats and rhythms.

It's the beauty with a lot of world music as well- I love listening to a host of African music and the lyrics sound so often as a vocal improvisation.

[Rit]

such as Godspeed You Black Emperor, i presume?

[maarts]

Godspeed is a good example. I find the passages where they don't use words (i.e. as in some of the bands' side projects) the most interesting.

It also stems from me growing up,in the Netherlands listening to music that was dominated by all these foreign bands and where lyrics for a large part weren't important because you couldn't understand them. I sang alon to the Beach Boys not knowing what the hell they were on about and it was the most enjoyable that way too. But also by being interested in a whole bunch of other musical styles which challenge you to change your perceptions of the stuff you are used to listen to.

[Rit]

yeah, that's true. like the value of travelling. exposing yourself to new sounds and sights.

Godspeed is often wordless, esp on their last album. A Silver Mt Zion is a bit more wordy, no?
have you heard Do Make Say Think?

[phil]

More often than not, it is a blessing
to be able to tune out the lyrics in a song ...

[maarts]

Yes I have indeed. I got Goodbye Enemy Airship The Landlord Is Dead, & Yet & Yet and Winter Hymn Country Hymn Secret Hymn and I find them very good. They mix up more variety in the build-up than GY!BE does.
A Silver Mount Zion is indeed the more wordy Godspeed, I like the string arrangements and the more folksy atmospheres. It's funny though, as 'arty farty' as that whole Montreal-collective sounds I find the instrumental albums/tracks less arty than the spoken word/sung ones, where the seemingless random word-selection grate me sometimes more than an out-of-tune saxophone tearing up the background music.

BTW, I recently listened to Jaga Jazzist's new album What We Must...now here's Norway's answer to the slowcore of Canada's finest!

[Rit]

i've seen the Do Makes several times (one of their guitarists works at my fave local music store), and i like them better than Godspeed. You hit the nail on the head perfectly = their buildups have more groove to them.

Winter Hymn was extraordinary.

[maarts]

I missed them when they came out here a year or so ago and I still kick myself for the omission. I heard a lot of good things about their gigs and from what I read in the indie-press with good reason.

And Phil- you're right. Sometimes it is nice to switch off lyrics, as much as sometimes it is essential to switch on to hear the lyrics too...Zappa springs to mind immediately!

_{(Come to think of it, Frank Zappa & The Mothers Of Invention were a very good American rock 'n rollband too, right?)}

[Rit]

no. they were not. I find Zappa overrated. I prefer his buddy, Cap'n Beefheart.

[maarts]

Funny you should say that. I find Don Van Vliet a charlatan. Interesting and talented but too high on the wire.

[Rit]

If Don Vliet was a charlatan, then what legitimates the Zapp?
too much snide, snickering humour in Zappa. that kind of cynicism doesn't appeal to me at all. i mean, what can you do with it, other than.. what? giggle quietly to yourself?

it's music with small limits.

Vliet was always a believer, and all his music is a sincere romp, even if it comes across as wilfully obscure (which it isn't, as a matter of fact -- it just takes some getting used to to be able to appreciate the Beefheart lingua franca)

[Rit]

plus, i don't like Zappa's straight up classical and jazz influences on his sleeve.
Beefheart tried his hand at a better synthesis, and used better influences (such as free jazz and the delta blues)

[phil]

First the Beatles...

Then Zappa !!

THIS IS WAR !!!!