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Post by shin on Mar 7, 2006 20:47:52 GMT -5
I'm just curious to know what the answer is to those who would seek to make abortion illegal.
What about the doctors? What should their punishment be?
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Post by strat-0 on Mar 7, 2006 20:58:03 GMT -5
Thumbscrews?
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Post by limitdeditionlayla on Mar 8, 2006 3:45:12 GMT -5
Melon, if abortion is criminalized, what should the punishment be for a woman who gets one? I know you didn't ask me, but I'd like to answer: FORGIVENESS and COMPASSION. So why is it so damn hard to get either of those from pro-lifers NOW? |
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Post by Galactus on Mar 8, 2006 11:28:28 GMT -5
Well, clearly they'd like it to be seen as murder, so it'd be punished in similar fashion one would assume.
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Post by shin on Mar 8, 2006 12:43:13 GMT -5
MATTHEWS: Well, let‘s talk about the mainstream. Would you like to repeal or have a court overrule Roe v. Wade?
TOOMEY: Yes, I would. I think that that was clearly not a legitimate decision. It was a case where five Supreme Court justices decided that...
MATTHEWS: Yes, so you would like to get rid of—yes, so you basically would like to see..
TOOMEY: They decided they were going to pass a law.
MATTHEWS: Well, do you think the Supreme Court was wrong in saying a woman has a right to an abortion in the first six months of pregnancy?
TOOMEY: Yes, I think they were wrong to say that. I think that‘s not
a legitimate decision. The Constitution is clearly silent on the issue of
abortion. States had addressed this issue, and the Supreme Court decided
it wanted to overrule the legislative bodies of all 50 states and so it
did. It issued an edict
(CROSSTALK)
MATTHEWS: If you go back to state‘s rights on abortion, would you support banning abortion in Pennsylvania?
TOOMEY: Yes, I would, yes.
(CROSSTALK)
MATTHEWS: In other words, if a woman had an abortion in Pennsylvania, what would you do to her?
TOOMEY: Well, you know, Chris
(CROSSTALK)
MATTHEWS: I‘m serious. What would you do to her? You said you want to ban it. You want to use the law to outlaw abortion.
TOOMEY: That‘s right.
MATTHEWS: What would you do to a woman who had an abortion? What would you do to her?
TOOMEY: Oh, I think we would first look at the doctor who is
performing the abortion and have some penalties
(CROSSTALK)
MATTHEWS: Why? Why don‘t you go after the woman? Why don‘t you go after the woman? In any other situation of law and justice, you go after the person who perpetrates the act. If it‘s wrong to commit...
(CROSSTALK)
MATTHEWS: No, really. This is what the whole issue of abortion is and where all the B.S. comes into this argument. Are you willing to say that you would put a woman in prison for having an abortion?
TOOMEY: Chris, I‘m not sure what the penalty would be. I‘m saying...
(CROSSTALK)
MATTHEWS: Well, say what you want it to be.
(CROSSTALK)
MATTHEWS: You said it should be banned. Would you please stand up for what you believe?
TOOMEY: That‘s right.
MATTHEWS: If abortion is wrong and it‘s a crime and it‘s murder, tell me what the punishment should be.
TOOMEY: And I‘m telling you that there should be legal action taken against the doctor who performs it.
MATTHEWS: And?
TOOMEY: And we‘ve got to think through what we would do with regard to the woman.
MATTHEWS: What would you like to do?
TOOMEY: But, Chris, that doesn‘t change the fact
(CROSSTALK)
MATTHEWS: You are running for the United States Senate.
(CROSSTALK)
MATTHEWS: And you‘ve said we ought to get rid of Roe v. Wade and you said that abortion should be banned in Pennsylvania, but you won‘t tell me what the penalty should be.
TOOMEY: That‘s right, Chris.
Look, we can take things one step at a time. I think that the constitutional decision was invalid. It‘s perfectly OK to believe that these justices made up a right that doesn‘t exist in the Constitution without deciding exactly what the penalty should be under all circumstances.
(CROSSTALK)
MATTHEWS: You want to make up a law without a penalty. It‘s a crime without a penalty. I‘ve never heard of such a thing.
(CROSSTALK)
MATTHEWS: Why declare something to be...
(CROSSTALK)
MATTHEWS: I‘m serious. This is the problem and the confusion over abortion rights in this country.
(CROSSTALK)
MATTHEWS: People on the far right side won‘t say what they‘ll do.
They simply say they don‘t like the way things are now. What would you do?
TOOMEY: Well, if we overturn Roe vs. wade, one of the things we could do is leave it to states to make some decisions about this.
(CROSSTALK)
MATTHEWS: And what would you support Pennsylvania doing? You are running for senator from Pennsylvania. What should Pennsylvania do to women who decide to have an abortion? What would you do to them?
TOOMEY: Chris, I‘ve told you, I haven‘t figured out what I think we
should be doing with
(CROSSTALK)
MATTHEWS: Well, shouldn‘t you figure out a few of these things before you run for office?
(CROSSTALK)
MATTHEWS: Shouldn‘t you make those basic decisions?
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Post by shin on Mar 8, 2006 12:43:46 GMT -5
So either these people haven't even thought about this, or they don't want to go out and admit they'd put women in jail for murder.
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Post by Weeping_Guitar on Mar 8, 2006 12:54:57 GMT -5
I'm just curious to know what the answer is to those who would seek to make abortion illegal. What about the doctors? What should their punishment be? 5 years in jail, of course. The South Dakota legislature knows best. In a unrelated note they topped off their calendar year by cutting $500,000 from SD Public Broadcasting's budget at a closed door meeting (you know, to save time). |
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Post by phil on Mar 8, 2006 13:01:21 GMT -5
Don't we already have a board to discuss this whole mess ... ??
Just a thought ... ! I'm waiting for Melon's definition of Hell !!
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Post by thorn on Mar 8, 2006 13:08:09 GMT -5
Turnabout is fair play.
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Post by thorn on Mar 8, 2006 13:08:32 GMT -5
haha! I see I have failed to log in.
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Post by Thorngrub on Mar 8, 2006 13:09:20 GMT -5
*I want y'all to know, my post count is actually 2 times higher than it appears under my avatar!* ;b
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Post by phil on Mar 8, 2006 13:15:54 GMT -5
HÉ ! I thought we could not post
if we didn't log on ...
... Nevermind !!
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Post by strat-0 on Mar 8, 2006 15:33:07 GMT -5
That's the way I had it set. Sometimes Proboards has a mind of its own. Since I just created this board a couple of days ago, it could be that it defaulted to 'guests can post.' They used to default to 'only members can post.'
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Post by melon1 on Mar 8, 2006 15:53:37 GMT -5
Ok, here goes Phil: On the other hand, I do wish I could simply dismiss your homophobic discourse, laugh it away and blame it on ignorance and or fear but I know too many gays, just decent, moral people who are truly hurt by the intolerance, the negative attitude and judgment directed by people like you toward all homosexuals just because of their nature, simply who they are …First off, Phil, I want to extend a handshake to you for a well-reasoned post. In all honesty, I've never even sensed the serious side of you whatsoever until I read said post. Perhaps that's because of your discourse with me. I have seen you post many times about things that you're obviously at least somewhat passionate about, but I've always sensed lurking behind that someone that doesn't take anything seriously. Of course, I should have known better. That should make it clear enough that you have strongly held views that you are quite sincere about indeed. For this I offer my apologies. Now, that being said, in response to this, allow me to let you in on something that might shock you a bit. In a good way. I don't believe homosexuality is in any way, shape or form a "choice". I was stupid enough some time ago to compare it to my sexual urges that started as far back as I remember, perhaps due to something that happened to me when I was young that I'm not aware of. I was that passionate at one time on the CE board about proving my point(speaking of how I'm not going to march in a parade about my weakness, but rather admit that it's a sin, a sickness and unnatural). I was stupid enough to trust you guys not to stoop so low as to bring it up again but I wasn't that lucky. I should've known better. What a brainfart. Shin was the first to throw it in my face saying that I'm a "closet S @ M deviant." I called him out on giving such a low-blow and nobody said shite about it. Had I said something like that I'm sure strat-o might have banned me from the boards as everyone would be raising hell. Chrisfan has a point. Now, even though the urges I've always struggled with are of a heterosexual nature, they are still just as unnatural as I believe homosexuality to be. But I will perhaps surprise you all by saying this: C.S. Lewis once said of "bad psychological material" that it didn't need to be repented of, but cured. In the same place he talks about this he mentions homosexuality. Perhaps he's right in stating that it needs to be "cured" rather than "repented of." The problem of modern day society is that we've all (almost all) come to accept that homosexuality is simply an alternative lifestyle, so then, if that's the case, it doesn't need to be cured. I suppose it makes me "homophobic" to think such a thing, but my thoughts on the subject remain. If that offends you, then it doesn't make me feel even better. It saddens me a bit, actually. I'll never, ever change my mind about this. But as I've mentioned before, and I'm not sure if anyone here read it, I had a gay friend in the last city I lived in and I would've taken the shirt off my back for him(no pun intended  ). I visited him at work(Wal-Mart) and would walk around with him while he was dustmopping the floor. I did my best to influence him for the better, but I left it at the fact that I had plant seeds and others would be sent to water them. I didn't try and shove anything down his throat(don't do it, Phil ). So, that being said, I contend that I care a great deal for homosexuals to the degree that I actually believe I'm showing more compassion than the people who are helping them along in deception. Of course, they don't know they are so it's not like it's intentional. Deception is what it is, guys. Sorry. I will always continue to call a spade a spade. But remember, I didn't bring up the homosexuality issue yet again. This post is a response to Phil's. |
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Post by melon1 on Mar 8, 2006 16:06:41 GMT -5
I’m giving you that description of Hell … Is it accurate ? What is your own take on Hell … ??
I believe that the horror and agony of Hell is worse than our finite minds can imagine at the moment. Whether it's a literal lake of fire, I dunno. I won't say that it is or it isn't. Whether it is or isn't, I'm determined not to go there. But I bet there's one guy who knows better than I. Let me tell you about him.
I talked with a friend about past drug experiences last night and we got to talking about our experiences on hallucenogenics. He was telling my other friend that the "weak-minded" should never do it in the first place. Shortly after that, he mentioned a guy he knew that walked into his bathroom tripping and saw his face in the mirror. The dude ended up staring at the mirror for 8 hours. In the words of my misguided friend, the dude "freaked out". If you ask me, he felt the need to come to grips with who he had become and had a catharsis over it. He wouldn't look away from the mirror until he saw the real "him" again. He felt he had no choice but to come to grips with what he really believed and how he had been running from it. I bet he tasted hell more than I ever have. Although this is only my perception of the matter, I bet he cried half of the time and sensed how much God loved him, and on that same token, how much the devil hated him. Why do I think this? According to my friend that told me about this guy, he's been a born again, on fire, Christian to this day!
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). I visited him at work(Wal-Mart) and would walk around with him while he was dustmopping the floor. I did my best to influence him for the better, but I left it at the fact that I had plant seeds and others would be sent to water them. I didn't try and shove anything down his throat(don't do it, Phil