Which Religion is the biggest physical threat?

[Matheus]

Exactly. See, Ken got it... did I really need to explain myself further?

[Rit]

kenholzman said:

matheus said:

Laugh all you want, I guess. Do I really have to write out a three paragraph sum of what I meant everytime I say something, especially when you pretty much summed up what I meant in the first place? I think you understood just fine, and I really don't think I should have said it any other way.

I actually agree with Mat. The rest of the world does want the American lifestyle -- all the glitz and glam that go along with places like Miami and L.A. -- not the more restrained Canadian version. And they also hate America b/c it it those things, and b/c we act like we own the world (particularly the current President and his staff). Other people both really dislike this and envy it. It's like in high school, the football quarterback and the prom king are both the most popular and most hated people in school, and other students can hold both opinions at the same time. I really do think that is how much of the rest of the world sees the US.

i agree with this. though i think you underestimate the appeal of Canada. not every one chases the glitz. many (europeans, asians) also see the understatedness of Canada as paradise.

[Rit]

matheus said:

Exactly. See, Ken got it... did I really need to explain myself further?

no, but you'll have to explain the electrosexual thing further.

[Thorngrub]

Man, that's a pretty decent summation of it, Ken.

Glad you & Toodles made it through the storm ok, Patlogi !

[upinkzeppelin2]

ritalinpants said:

That is the way I see it, that Jesus was speaking...to help insure our role as the humble Guardians of this world by which to maintain and establish the Kingdom of Heaven here and now while we're breathing and alive.

this i couldn't agree with you more on. it's a gnostic idea that rings true to me. the kingdom of heaven is now. not in the future.

"Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done on earth as it is in heaven."

- Jesus Christ

[Rit]

...except that there is no heaven.

[Rit]

Thorns, here's your men.

www.cnn.com/2007/TECH/space/04/25/habitable.planet.ap/index.html

[Thorngrub]

ritalinpants said:

...except that there is no heaven.

Not yet, anyhow...

[Rit]

until it is re-built, hand by hand, brick by brick.... Heaven is a broken ruin right now, overgrown with choked weeds, careless cracks in the mighty edifice.

[sisyphus]

it all depends on what you think heaven is. if you're talking about some place unaffected by time, change, chaos, and imperfection then you're right. the very idea is absurd and unlikely, and it sounds incredibly dull.

i think it's just a state of being, though, and we're always passing through different states of being. i was in and out of heaven a couple of times yesterday thanks to good literature, good convo, and good friends. every once in a while i go hang out in hell, too. and i must like it, because i go back. i guess it's a place i go to be alone. in any case, it makes heaven that much better when i'm hanging out there. i think that 80% of the time i'm hanging out somewhere between heaven and hell, and 12 percent of the time i'm hanging out in heaven, and 8% percent of the time i'm smothering myself in hell's steamy fumes. hahaha. percentages. so kidding about that. and so not.

[sisyphus]

a good orgasm long and temptuous in coming can be like the face of god... a good mindgasm long and temptuous in coming can be like seeing past the face of god and into god's soul.

[sisyphus]

god's will is done in heaven, because we are god, and our will is to be happy, and when we're happy we're doing god's will, which is our will, which is heaven.

[sisyphus]

of course a lot of people do a lot of things that they THINK will make them happy, and they end up finding that they were wrong and those things they craved were hollow.... but when they 'align themselves with god's will" or discover their own true will outside of ego and shit, they get happy heaven buzz.

[sisyphus]

wrote some conjecture in my journal yesterday:

Most kinds of vanity seem to be wrappings for various insecurities. The proud among us are often deeply insecure, and the more humble are usually quite confident.

Some of us are oblivious in our self-assuredness because we have not grown out of the self-centered world views of our childhood. Vanity is not necessarily masking insecurity in these cases. Instead, this self-assuredness is merely a naive manifestation of a lack of experience and/or perception. We have not yet begun to notice where we do and do not "measure up" in relation to other people.

As we mature, however, we begin to awaken to the reality of our own relative positions within the world. For many of us this is very frightening, and so we cling desperately to our egos and struggle to defend the concepts of self we held as children. We build vanities like protective bandages around all our insecurities and guard them carefully. This time is like a mourning period for the death of our childish egos. Hopefully we don't turn into those sorts of people who disdain simply because we were disdained...

When we're finally able to confront the loss of our childish egos and accept that loss without fear, we stop taking ourselves so seriously. We're able to honestly evaluate ourselves, clearly recognizing our flaws and virtues without becoming defensive and resorting to the protective aid of vanity. We no longer seek the approval of others because we're able to hear our own inner voices. We're able to obtain a certain degree of objectivity about ourselves AND the world around us.

None of us are really locked into any one of these three stages. We all seem to move back and forth between them, depending on the situation. However, hopefully we're all shooting to spend the majority of our time in the third stage, because it's in from this place that we're able to do the most good for ourselves and others. From this vantage point, we're able to empathize with people in ANY of the stages without arrogance or insecurity. We're able to maintain a sense of tact and kindness balanced with directness depending on our sensitivity to a person's needs. We'll be acting from a place of little ego, not sheltering unnecessarily in our fear to hurt feelings, nor being unduly cruel. We'll be happy.

All our little egos are like a bunch of jagged rocks in a tumbler. We bumb up against each other and polish one another. we're a social organism.

[Kensterberg]

Heaven is a place where nothing ever happens.