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Post by kmc on Mar 13, 2007 15:51:53 GMT -5
Uhmm, PEW is a troll. I am sure you know that, but just in case...
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Post by Thorngrub on Mar 13, 2007 16:04:37 GMT -5
I know, I know. We tried, Rocky's right. But in the words of someone who resembles a troll somewhat, "There is no try. Only do" To which I believe an unspecified rockist-jedi answered "Do be do be do", thus was borne the "Post -Indy" movement.
Just a bit of future history for ya geeks.
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Post by shin on Mar 13, 2007 16:05:16 GMT -5
I hate you Sedaka clique fuckers. Banned. |
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Post by Galactus on Mar 13, 2007 16:05:41 GMT -5
Sometimes y'all surprise me. Here you have a person who is qualified to speak w/yourselves who are qualified about this thing called "rockjism", which you are all pretty learned about, I'd say. Y'all are "rockists" to the core, ded, kMc, shin, admit it ! And there's nothing wrong with that... ... but d'yall EVER turn the other cheek ? D'ya ever even think about it- ? Try it sometime. Ya might find future convos enriched because of it. Ya might make friends. *shrugs* I am not a rockist. I don't try to define quality in music, nor do I use terms to try and pigeonhole artists so I can justify meatheaded standards decided upon by no one other then my self. There is simply no reason a person can't objective look at music outside one's own personal opinions. I dig that you don't see it that way but this is not an all or none proposition. As far as turning the other cheek, how many people on either of these boards do I not get along with? I've been nothing but civil today but that's guy's like a broken fucking record. If he wants to join the discussion then I welcome it, just hop on in. "Yeah, I agree with this" "No, but here's what I think" instead this guy pops in here like he's going to teach us. He's going to show us turds the way. No thanks, thorn. I don't need more friends that bad. Until he shows he has any interest at all in actually listening to someone else here, I'll continue to block him out. |
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Post by kmc on Mar 13, 2007 16:07:38 GMT -5
I hate you Sedaka clique fuckers. Banned. Whatever, dude. RocDoc and I are going to start our own super secret clique. Let's go, RocDoc! |
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Post by shin on Mar 13, 2007 16:11:40 GMT -5
There is objectivity in the quality of music, irrelevant to personal experience or integrity or rockjism or any of that jive.
For starters, tonality. Some chords are mathematically suited while others are not. Some rhythms are in time and some are not. Some harmonies are suitable and some are not. Some people have range in their voices, some do not.
This is the objectivity in music. The funny thing is, our ears are naturally tuned toward such objectively "better" music. It's why we wince when someone hits a note wrong, or when someone hits a hot spot and you get a blast of feedback.
And, oh sure, you can argue Cobain was all about forcing that barrage of feedback on us by shoving his strat against the stack and that's what made him genius, and I would personally concur, but when Pink Floyd slither their way through Comfortably Numb, even if its for the 5000th time, it's still technically better music.
What's subjective is whether or not it moves you to listen to it more than Milk It.
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Post by shin on Mar 13, 2007 16:16:01 GMT -5
And that's what I find so appealing about PF...just their complete adherance to the fundamental laws of music making, taking the foundation of blues and building a whole nation of prog on top of it. They didn't destroy the cornerstone, they just built their bridges longer and higher. Just because a billion stoner-prep-jock fags have posters on their dorm room walls along with the required Marley/2pac/Scarface ones doesn't take away from what that band was and always will be.
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Post by Thorngrub on Mar 13, 2007 16:19:10 GMT -5
There is objectivity in the quality of music, irrelevant to personal experience or integrity or rockjism or any of that jive. For starters, tonality. Some chords are mathematically suited while others are not. Some rhythms are in time and some are not. Some harmonies are suitable and some are not. Some people have range in their voices, some do not. This is the objectivity in music. The funny thing is, our ears are naturally tuned toward such objectively "better" music. It's why we wince when someone hits a note wrong, or when someone hits a hot spot and you get a blast of feedback. And, oh sure, you can argue Cobain was all about forcing that barrage of feedback on us by shoving his strat against the stack and that's what made him genius, and I would personally concur, but when Pink Floyd slither their way through Comfortably Numb, even if its for the 5000th time, it's still technically better music. What's subjective is whether or not it moves you to listen to it more than Milk It. This is quite reasonable. Good call shin |
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Post by Thorngrub on Mar 13, 2007 16:20:02 GMT -5
And that's what I find so appealing about PF...just their complete adherance to the fundamental laws of music making, taking the foundation of blues and building a whole nation of prog on top of it. They didn't destroy the cornerstone, they just built their bridges longer and higher. Just because a billion stoner-prep-jock fags have posters on their dorm room walls along with the required Marley/2pac/Scarface ones doesn't take away from what that band was and always will be. Again, hail hail. I can get behind this. |
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Post by kmc on Mar 13, 2007 16:28:54 GMT -5
Ok, so, in that vein, would we agree that "Maggot Brain" is better than "Comfortably Numb"? Is "YYZ" better than "Comfortably Numb?" Because those sound, to my years, to be a hell of a lot better than "Comfortably Numb" as far as "adherence to the fundamental laws of music making go". I mean, no one is missing any notes in those songs there. What's the deal?
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Post by Galactus on Mar 13, 2007 16:31:35 GMT -5
Only if it moves you, Ken.
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JACkory
Struggling Artist
Posts: 167
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Post by JACkory on Mar 13, 2007 16:34:09 GMT -5
Erm, No-one here envies Phil for having seen the Beatles in Montreal, not even just a little? ++++++++++++++++++++ The Hendrix In Sweden thing in 1967 is the best example I can cite as to my already being an avowed rock guitar fanatic, and this crazy guy comes on, during the infancy of FM radio, late at night...and like that VU story people talk about, where all those who bought the (crappy, oops!) first album went out and started bands, I talked to like-minded music fans my own age across the city who actually heard THAT same broadcast that same night and had the same 'WHA?!" reaction that I did. I don't envy Phil one bit. The Beatles best work was done in the studio. All you ever heard at a Beatles concert was screaming teenage girls. And I don't mean to be rude, but I think you lose a lot of credibility when you call VU's first album "crappy". I cannot for the life of me fathom what standards you are applying to it that you would fail to see how amazingly original it is (and originality is a benchmark positive trait for ANY band as far as I'm concerned). I might chime in on the whole Pink Floyd debate at some later point in time. Suffice to say that I voted for Animals because it's my favorite. I will say this...until The Wall Pink Floyd, at least in the states, were an underground phenomenon, getting very little radio play and most of the respect they garnered was from audiophiles and recreational drug users. |
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Post by kmc on Mar 13, 2007 16:34:45 GMT -5
Only if it moves you, Ken. Got it. |
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Post by Thorngrub on Mar 13, 2007 16:35:31 GMT -5
& I hear ya, DED. You know as well as I that I've been here w/y'all since the get go. I know all about PEW's history on these boards. I also know the majority of people here think of him as a troll, and maybe I should to, but I'll have to be honest here. Once upon a time in Peanuts land, this one kid named "PigPen" was standin around w/his pals, when a rainstorm suddenly broke and cleaned all the dirt and flies offa him. His pals were rather astounded to find there was actually a kid under there, after all. I kinda think the same about PEW. That he's not so much a "troll" (although yes I realize he has certainly done his share of trollin' & baitin') as he is simply an online surfer w/a poor grasp of netiquette. Should the fact he's been at it for years w/out much noticeable improvement indicate his troll status ? You're welcome to think so; you may be right. I just think he has a lot to learn about "listening" as well as speaking; that he's so clueless about proper social networking and general conversational decency, that all his efforts at being accepted into any online community are for naught, and result in his banishment and being branded a "troll". Whereas, I think there's hope in him yet. But certainly not w/the likes of you who seem to be of a certain mindset - that of refusing ever to possibly consider giving him the benefit of the doubt (because you "already have", "we've been thru this already", yadda yadda, I know I know). Well it's obvious if no one else is going to give him a 2nd chance - then he's never going to have the opportunity to prove himself. That much is perfectly obvious. All I'm sayin' is . . . this is an online forum. How dangerous can it be to, what -? Get yer fingernails dirty ? Turn the ol' cheek for the 10th time -? 11th time -? Obviously after awhile, why bother. I get that. But I'm not the only one on this forum who has witnessed PEW, ever once in awhile, actually state something technically "ok", that would deserve a "passing grade", and what do some of the posters here do -? "shut the fuck up troll" "Shut up Pew" It's just fuckin silly, is all. Me? *shrugs* If PEW is nice to me, I'm nice to him. Simple as that. If he says something - yes, the very least thing rude or inappropriate, I won't deny throwin' it back 10X as hard, I'm a vindictive lil internet bitch like that. But I've actually experienced progress in cultivating more meaningful relationships w/people online because of this attitude. I don't expect any of you to care one way or the other about doing so for yourselves, as ded mentioned, you've probably already got enough friends as it is. One last thing (while I'm on this high horse;): If one person, just one person, say, SHIN for instance, can't or won't for whatever reasons, come to a truce and make friends with someone like PEW online, then we've already lost the war on terror. A good day to you, gentlemen.  |
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Post by shin on Mar 13, 2007 16:42:38 GMT -5
Hard for me to make friends with PEW considering I ate his child.
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