Do politics keep you from liking certain artists?

[rockysigman]

Definately have to agree with Chrisfan's sentiments here. For one, if running for office is the only valid way to be politically active, than anything Arnold did before he ran for office was stupid and nonconsequential, as much as any other celebrity's political actions now.

But more to the point, I think for a lot of celebrities, they can actually be more affective for their causes by being spokesmen rather than actually being politicians. As celebrities they are unique in that they automatically have an audience willing to listen -- more than most people do anyway -- and just by using those resources to speak out and spreading the word to the most people they can, then they might be able to make a bigger difference than running for some small office. Or even a large one, as many of them know that, although they are well informed in their views, they probably still aren't all necessarily qualified for every political job. And if the point of political activism is to be affective in making changes for a cause, and they can be more affective just be being spokespeople, then why should they run for office?

[Artknocker]

Just a suggestion.

[Mary]

artknocker said:

Whatever, Mary--that wasn't even the point. But it's not like people aren't going to remember that you said a whole lot more than that (you always do). And it's not like I misquoted you. You do stand by that quote, do you not?

Not without the sentence that followed it, which was the whole point.

Anyway, since my posts are apparently too long for you, I'll distill it down to a couple of brief questions. I'd be genuinely curious to hear your response:

Are you bothered by all artists who make political statements, or only by popular musicians and Hollywood actors who do so? Do the politics of people like Picasso, Diego Rivera, and Bertolt Brecht annoy you as much as Tim Robbins and Eddie Vedder? If not, what's the difference?

Cheers, (there you are, I'm not the slightest bit angry!)
M

[Artknocker]

I thought I pasted the entire paragraph. And FWIW, I read your entire post.

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that you're the only one here who cares about the politics of Picasso, Diego Rivera, and Bertolt Brecht.

I'll be completely honest: I'm only annoyed by the actors and musicians who are annoying.

[Nepenthe]

Ok I will be honest, I can't stand the artists Mary mentioned, and it isn't just because of their politics. I truely hate the sick demented looking paintings. Nor can I stand any of the crap Pearl Jam does (this is all very well known by many anyway, so no real revelation here), and same reasons as above. I don't like their music or their politics.

The whole "rock the vote" deal was completely stupid and Rollingstone magazine makes me want to puke these days.

I saw a comment from Pissin earlier about Alice Cooper. The only thing I have to say about that is, his point was that music shouldn't be about politics in the sense of "trying to rock votes" one way or another. Alice Cooper has songs about issues, everyday life, and world events, I don't really consider that exactly politics per say.

[Nepenthe]

As a matter of fact I think he really hates politics, hence "Elected" and the fact that he mockingly ran for president.

[chrisfan]

artknocker said:

I thought I pasted the entire paragraph. And FWIW, I read your entire post.

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that you're the only one here who cares about the politics of Picasso, Diego Rivera, and Bertolt Brecht.

I'll be completely honest: I'm only annoyed by the actors and musicians who are annoying.

Mary is not the only one here who cares about the politics of the artists listed.

When you say you're only annoyed by actors and musicians who are annoying ... does that mean they're all annoying? Or that there are some artists and musicians who are political and not annoying to you? If it's the second, who is not annoying to you?

[Mary]

artknocker said:

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that you're the only one here who cares about the politics of Picasso, Diego Rivera, and Bertolt Brecht.

Actually, not everyone who posts here is as anti-intellectual as you are. I suspect people like dwazee and doc drum, who have art degrees, probably are also interested in the political statements made by artists. Just a guess.

Ok I will be honest, I can't stand the artists Mary mentioned, and it isn't just because of their politics. I truely hate the sick demented looking paintings.

Ummm, Diego Rivera drew lots of murals depicting peasants working in fields... I'm not really sure what was "sick and demented" about them.... and Brecht was a playwright, not a painter. So I presume you're only talking about picasso then??

M

[phil]

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say that you're the only one here who cares about the politics of Picasso, Diego Rivera, and Bertolt Brecht.


That limb is straining dangerously !

I'd be real careful if I was you ...

[phil]

Art is meant to disturb.
(Georges Braque)

[Nepenthe]

mary said:

artknocker said:

Ummm, Diego Rivera drew lots of murals depicting peasants working in fields... I'm not really sure what was "sick and demented" about them.... and Brecht was a playwright, not a painter. So I presume you're only talking about picasso then??

M

Mary, I know what Diego painted. Sorry that my opinion of his art doesn't match yours. Sorry if this doesn't appeal to me whatsoever.









Oh and next time I guess I will be more specific and say something like this so that it sinks in better:

I don't like either of the painters that Mary mentioned.

[Kensterberg]

Tuatha -- you don't like Picasso? Or Rivera's other (more naturalistic) work? I'm surprised that anyone can dislike all of either painter's output. Each produced such a broad spectrum of work that it seems like some of it is bound to connect with you. Even if it's just something like Picasso's sketches.

And everyone just has to love Jonathon Richman's classic "Pablo Picasso" right?

Pablo Picasso never got called an asshole.

[Nepenthe]

kenholzman said:

Tuatha -- you don't like Picasso? Or Rivera's other (more naturalistic) work? I'm surprised that anyone can dislike all of either painter's output. Each produced such a broad spectrum of work that it seems like some of it is bound to connect with you. Even if it's just something like Picasso's sketches.

And everyone just has to love Jonathon Richman's classic "Pablo Picasso" right?

Pablo Picasso never got called an asshole.

Ok you got me, some of the more natural stuff they did is good. But there are tons of artists that are much better. Many whom were never famous or known. This is the problem I have with the whole "art" thing.

And as for Picasso being an asshole? Well I guess I shouldn't pass judgement on him. But from everything I have read about him, if I were one of his female "friends" I might be inclined to call him an asshole.

[Mary]

It's completely 100% fine with me if you dislike Picasso and Rivera - I didn't mean to sound at all snippy about it. It's just that Rivera's most famous work is so, as Ken put it, naturalistic, it seemed odd to dismiss it as "sick and demented" so I was doublechecking - yeah, he went through a cubism phase because he was influenced by Picasso, but I was thinking of the murals he drew to represent working people in mexico and couldn't imagine how those could strike anyone as "demented" - that's all.

Of course, as Ken points out, Picasso himself did more straightforward work too, but I could comprehend your take on him since his more experimental stuff is his most famous...

And ftr, ken was just quoting a line from a song called Pablo Picasso by the Modern Lovers....I don't think he was actually trying to make a point about Picasso's temperament!!

I do love Picasso, and lots of modernists, but I understand that lots of folks have some line beyond which art just gets too strange, or non-representational, or willfully unpleasant, to be appreciated - we just have that line in very different places. I could stare at the Guernica all night, but abstract expressionism and minimalism invariably put me to sleep. I just don't get it.

Cheers,
M

[phil]

People discuss my art and pretend to understand
as if it were necessary to understand,
when it's simply necessary to love.

(Claude Monet)